Talk:Interstate 40

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Crime

I want to add a section about crime. I am confused by the remark that this is "off topic". There is enough content to write an entire article and a section in this article. Thoughts? Wrensewn (talk) 20:41, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The paragraph is misplaced in the lead of the article since an article lead needs to be a summary of the content of an article.

As for the history section, did this impact the physical configuration of I-40? Did it result in some change to the highway? If not, it's a bit tangential then. If there's enough content to write an entire article, perhaps it should be written there then. Imzadi 1979 → 21:09, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

To follow up, this might warrant a short mention in the Controversies subsection of the History, but it doesn't warrant a top-level section after the lead. However, any mention probably needs just a little bit more context. I-40 is a very long highway, and if these crimes are concentrated in one section, one half, etc, then the short paragraph needs to provide that context. Otherwise, it's all very ambiguous, and maybe not even surprising given that I-40 is over 2,556 miles (4,113 km) in length. Imzadi 1979 → 21:13, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

I don't know what you mean by "top-level". The section was placed in alphabetical order. I decided against the controversy section because it is not a controversy. There was absolutely no controversy to speak of, only widely reported facts. Wrensewn (talk) 21:31, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

Yeah, and that location gave the topic undue prominence given that highway article sections are handled by topic area. Given that it is a form of legal situation, like the lawsuits, it would fit there better than being given its own full section right after the lead. Otherwise, it needs to go after the exit list and before the end matter (see also/references/external links). That content still needs some context and connection to the topic other than just happening on the highway. Imzadi 1979 → 22:43, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

It's not where the murders happened that is important. It's serial killers seeking to evade detection along highway routes. This criminal behavior pattern was first identified in the I-40 investigation. The FBI's traditional model is serial killers who stay in their "comfort zone" where they "hide in plain sight". The I-40 investigation had policy significance according to RS. [1] Wrensewn (talk) 23:38, 29 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

If the location is tangential to the topic, then this doesn't belong in the I-40 article. It would belong elsewhere. Or put another away, was there something specific about I-40 that connected it to crimes, or did the criminals just happen to use I-40 for their crimes.

It's similar to the fact that we don't cover accidents in highway articles just because they happened on a highway. If something about the highway caused the accident, especially if that resulted in a change to the highway, then it belongs.

That source doesn't tie the crimes to I-40. It ties them to the concept of a highway, perhaps, but not to I-40 specifically. Absent that connection, this is the wrong location for the content. Imzadi 1979 → 00:00, 30 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

The location is important for reasons other than the murder happening on the highway. We don't know where the murders happened. We only know where the bodies were found. Wrensewn (talk) 00:07, 30 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

That sounds like a tangential connection though. Did something about I-40 itself cause or induce the murders? No. Did something about I-40 itself change because of the murders? No.

The location may be important for the murders, but it isn't important for the roadway.^[1] More to the point, the fact that that there was a highway, any highway, is the important detail relating to the murders, not this highway. So this may be something better suited to a higher level article, say to talk about the usage of Interstate Highways for the facilitation of crime generally in the article on the Interstate Highway System. The topic may not be limited to just the Interstates, and maybe it belongs in an even more general article.

It's still like the idea that we generally don't cover vehicle accidents in highway articles. Mostly, that's because they're relatively common.^[2] Each is a tragedy to the impacted people, but unless the highway has gained a reputation for a lack of safety, there isn't much worth saying on individual highway articles.^[3] Traffic safety is more generally a topic for more generalized articles.

I-40 might be an example of the usage of an Interstate to facilitate crime, but unless there is something particularized to this specific highway, I don't think the addition to this article is warranted. Imzadi 1979 → 17:32, 30 March 2025 (UTC)[reply]

References

^ And you've still not answered the question about where along I-40 these incident occurred. I-40 runs a long way from California to North Carolina, and it matters a lot if these incidents were concentrated along one state's segment or diffused throughout the entire length. If they were concentrated to one state segment, there are state-specific sub articles for each of eight states along I-40, and maybe it could make sense to cover this in on of those sub articles.
^ The counterpoint to this is the one vehicle accident on M-185 on Michigan's Mackinac Island in 2005. Because vehicles are banned on the island, a travel article in the Toronto Star in 2000 made a special note that it was the only state highway that had never had a vehicle accident. That minor accident in 2005 is noteworthy and included in the M-185 article because it is so exceptional.
^ Various highways have gained a reputation for danger. U.S. Route 66 was nicknamed "Bloody 66" in places because the narrow highway wasn't suited to the amount of traffic using it. Measures were taken to correct these deficiencies, replacing it with a freeway design suited to those traffic levels. Now US 66 has been functionally replaced by Interstate Highways that are much safer than the old roadway.

[1] And you've still not answered the question about where along I-40 these incident occurred. I-40 runs a long way from California to North Carolina, and it matters a lot if these incidents were concentrated along one state's segment or diffused throughout the entire length. If they were concentrated to one state segment, there are state-specific sub articles for each of eight states along I-40, and maybe it could make sense to cover this in on of those sub articles.

[2] The counterpoint to this is the one vehicle accident on M-185 on Michigan's Mackinac Island in 2005. Because vehicles are banned on the island, a travel article in the Toronto Star in 2000 made a special note that it was the only state highway that had never had a vehicle accident. That minor accident in 2005 is noteworthy and included in the M-185 article because it is so exceptional.

[3] Various highways have gained a reputation for danger. U.S. Route 66 was nicknamed "Bloody 66" in places because the narrow highway wasn't suited to the amount of traffic using it. Measures were taken to correct these deficiencies, replacing it with a freeway design suited to those traffic levels. Now US 66 has been functionally replaced by Interstate Highways that are much safer than the old roadway.

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