Talk:Chess960

Fischer Chess as an original name

This is a little bit of a rabbit hole, but bear with me.

So I noticed there wasn't a source in the "Naming" section for calling it Fischerandom Chess or just Fischerandom. I did a rough look over some of the sources we use in the article, but wasn't satisfied. I tossed the question into ChatGPT to see if it could come up with some sources. It sent me to a reddit post discussing this, which cited this blog: https://chess960frc.blogspot.com/2011/12/can-i-use-this-name-fischer-chess.html

That blog quotes dialogue from a video, though they admit to editing it slightly, but preserved the meaning. That quote indicates that Fischer was considering licensing the name "Fischer Chess".

Naturally I was skeptical, so I looked for the source of this quote. It references another blog post: https://chess960frc.blogspot.com/2011/12/when-vishy-met-bobby.html That blog post references a video on the now defunct blip.tv: http://blip.tv/macauley/fischer-remembered-615028

Blip.tv shutdown in 2015. I checked archive.org (I'm not super familiar with using it) and could not find an archive of the video playing. I checked youtube hoping there might have been a reupload, but Youtube search is hot garbage and returned nothing. However, in a google search I found: http://www.chessdryad.com/articles/mi/381.htm This page discusses the video referring it as "ICC's special "Fischer Remembered" video filmed and edited by Macauley Peterson".

I looked into Macauley Peterson, apparently he's a chess journalist and I found his personal website. https://www.macauleypeterson.com/Bio.htm

I am a little burned out on this search, but if someone is interested in contacting him and/or the ICC to see if they have a copy of this video, then we could use it as a source (the chessdryad site mentions it was released under creative commons) and we could include the name Fischer Chess as an original name.

FlamingFabrication (talk) 08:09, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

The first entry in the Bibliography is Gligoric's book, Shall We Play Fischerandom Chess? Would this not be suitable as a source for that name? We are already citing it for other things. Bruce leverett (talk) 16:52, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

I gave the book a rough look over. I didn't see any references to the term "Fischer Chess", only "Fischerandom". FlamingFabrication (talk) 21:22, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

You wrote, I noticed there wasn't a source in the "Naming" section for calling it Fischerandom Chess or just Fischerandom, so I'm saying the book could be just such a source. As for "Fischer chess", this is the first I ever saw that, so I can't be much help. Bruce leverett (talk) 23:12, 3 March 2025 (UTC)

Ah I see. I've cited the book source you mentioned (and verified that it was in the book) for those two names. Fischer Chess though still needs to be investigated. FlamingFabrication (talk) 02:34, 4 March 2025 (UTC)

Also called "Freestyle chess"?

Is it appropriate to add "Freestyle chess" as an alternative designation in the lead sentence? That seems to be what it is mainly being called lately. e.g. "I like Freestyle more than Classical right now" - R Praggnanandhaa [1]; or "Freestyle chess is another name for Chess960, which was coined and popularized by a 2024 chess event called the Freestyle G.O.A.T. Challenge" - chess.com [2]. Adpete (talk) 05:52, 19 July 2025 (UTC)

This is discussed in Talk:Chess960/Archive 3#Naming issues. An editor objected to including it among the names we list, because it is trademarked by the organizer of the Freestyle tournaments, and so it's like we are doing their marketing for them. Bruce leverett (talk) 20:54, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

Interesting. The two references I provide above suggest the name is passing into wider usage though. Perhaps we should have a sentence stating it is a trademarked name. Adpete (talk) 23:28, 20 July 2025 (UTC)

It's a bit of a misnomer because of the Freestyle events. It's along the same lines of calling tissue paper Kleenex--it's not wrong, but it's using a brand name in lieu of it's two extant names that have been in use since the variant was first popularized.

Given the history of the naming of this variant and the names used by the major governing bodies of chess in their documentation, it is clear that Fischerandom and Chess960 are the defacto names used by the broader chess community. The names in the lede should remain consistent with that and not include potentially temporary fad names and brand names unless they reach the same prevailing usage in the chess community. Mentions of these new alternatives should stay in the "Naming" section (and elsewhere when relevant) until then. A similar consensus was reached previously with the name Chess9LX. FlamingFabrication (talk) 21:25, 26 July 2025 (UTC)

Quite a bit should be removed

I've done a few edits over the last few days, mostly just rearranging. But now I'm thinking some parts should be removed, or drastically shortened:

1. "Creating starting positions" section should be removed, or moved to a footnote. This is not a math article.
2. "Castling - observation" section is mostly stating the obvious or WP:OR, and can be almost entirely removed. The rules are really simple, but these 2 sections make the rules take up about 2 screens.
3. In the "History" section, the two sections on Van Zuylen van Nijevelt should be moved to Displacement chess, leaving just a sentence or two here. It's a precursor to Chess960, nothing more.
4. The "Tournaments" section has too much detail and should be considerably shortened, with the details in the articles on the respective tournaments. e.g. the Mainz and St. Louis club sections should be brief, perhaps listing the years and the winners, but not extra details like the scores - that belongs in separate articles on those tournaments. This will become more important as more Chess960 gets played in the future, as seems likely.

Adpete (talk) 08:12, 25 July 2025 (UTC)